Revisiting the YouTuber Rank.

[Raj]

If it was super costly to cater to YouTubers, I’d agree we shouldn’t cater to YouTubers. But this is literally 0 cost. I fail to see the issue ngl. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with rewarding players for doing what they can, regardless of if they’re a YouTuber or staff or helper or whatever. If having more staff was something that genuinely benefited the server like having more YouTubers does, then we would also want to incentivize people becoming staff. It’s a poor argument IMO to say “staff and helpers get no rewards so why should YouTubers”. There’s no link between the two is the thing. If it made sense for staff to get rewards, then they should get rewards. But it just doesn’t make sense like it does for content creators. Being a staff is probably easier and already has certain incentives anyway

[Fungamer]

If it was super costly to cater to YouTubers, I’d agree we shouldn’t cater to YouTubers. But this is literally 0 cost. I fail to see the issue ngl. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with rewarding players for doing what they can, regardless of if they’re a YouTuber or staff or helper or whatever. If having more staff was something that genuinely benefited the server like having more YouTubers does, then we would also want to incentivize people becoming staff. It’s a poor argument IMO to say “staff and helpers get no rewards so why should YouTubers”. There’s no link between the two is the thing. If it made sense for staff to get rewards, then they should get rewards. But it just doesn’t make sense like it does for content creators. Being a staff is probably easier and already has certain incentives anyway

I'm saying neither should get rewards. I can't name a single player who has come to or stayed on PKH because they saw a youtube video. The server doesn't need youtubers nor does it really benefit from them. The audience simply isn't there. The recognition in form of a rank and letting them post their content in a special discord channel is nice for them. Previewing content and what not would be nice too but I guess something like that is up to the supers to decide (and a bit useless since we have test server previews for most major content releases anyways).

[Raj]

My take is completely opposite. I think that if there is no cost to an action, and there is some chance it goes well and adds even a single player, with no true downsides in the case it goes poorly, then it’s worth taking that action. YouTuber isn’t some abusable rank where people can do damage if they’re in it for the incentives and get bored. The GP added to the eco (100b a month?) is tiny in the grand scheme of things, assuming people even use it

Edit: worth mentioning the cost of this action is zero in terms of player and staff and owner investment. In the context of the dev team, the cost of working on that over other things does need to be weighed. But it’d simply be queued for later if time is better spent elsewhere now.

[Thearlygamer]

Good points about staff. But what about helpers and people who frequently edit the wiki? They have no power that can be abused.

I still don't feel like it's right to reward players for something that has so little impact on the servers wellbeing. I respect the great amount of effort that people who do make youtube vids put into producing those vids, but both their relevance and impact is minimal. Even with incentives that aren't ridiculously OP it's not like we'll attract a youtuber with 10K+ subs or something.

I personally don't see the youtubers as the best way to advertise to new players to COME to the game, rather have new players STAY with the game. Giving them something to see to understand the game, peoples series, seeing lively pk videos, progress series to make them excited to play the game themselves is what I think youtubers make it worth giving them some kind of pay out for their quality work.

As far as bringing new players to the game, I agree the RSPS community is dwindling, RSPS lists are rigged from my understanding (if not we should have given ironmen a reason to vote 3 years ago). If making a OSRS bot to advertise at the G.E. is the best way, then why not do that? If it brings 2-10 unique players a week it'd be worth it. I think progressions on PkH is fast enough to make players enjoy it, just keep releasing content as fast as possible to keep the community happy, with events to keep the community engaged. The Youtuber rank will just give new/old players somethign to watch to stay engaged and maybe see content they didn't even know we had that they can try out themselves.

[Patel]

I'm saying neither should get rewards. I can't name a single player who has come to or stayed on PKH because they saw a youtube video. The server doesn't need youtubers nor does it really benefit from them. The audience simply isn't there. The recognition in form of a rank and letting them post their content in a special discord channel is nice for them. Previewing content and what not would be nice too but I guess something like that is up to the supers to decide (and a bit useless since we have test server previews for most major content releases anyways).

I mean... Ain's videos did precisely that. I couldn't name them, but I know there were quite a few.

If I'm totally honest, if not for the blatant negligence that some people in power had towards Ain's contributions to the server (back when we were all kids and took that shit personally), I wouldn't have been arguing in favor of a Youtuber rank as much, if at all. Dude racked up atleast half a million views on PkHonor videos alone (you can actually count, I got bored after 400k but there were still a lot of PkHonor videos to tally) and sometimes got as many messages from new players as mods did.

The current rank, in my view, is a compromise of what I once believed it should've been and nothing at all.

The idea that staff members or ranks don't deserve rewards is a hard stance of the following idealism: staff members and ranked individuals should not seek rewards from their ranks, they should be motivated by passion or their ideals/personalities. Often we are jaded by years of experience in seeing people fail to meet this ideal, and we just assume that because there exists a reward, people will seek it out rather than commit to the true purpose of the job. So it's natural to bifurcate into one stance or the other.

However, rewarding their efforts (which are legitimately efforts a lot of the time, it can feel like a job) is not inherently bad. Staff members should/did get a boost in ::skilling, and also should be allowed to get a gift on Christmas (which I believe they often do). I don't think Youtubers, who have brought people to the game (I don't know if that still happens, but it certainly did and served as a strong motivator for the rank in the first place), should be exempt from in game rewards either. The problem is, I can agree that the influence of individual YouTubers seems lower than the past, and many of the popular RSPS Youtubers are exactly what we DON'T want in an ideal Youtuber - they seek out the servers that reward them over ones that wouldn't, like PkHonor.

Don't get me wrong - it's still fantastic that we do what we do. I don't want this to seem like the YT rank is inadequate - the idealism is removed from the reality of the situation and there is a ton of value in simply being recognized for great work on this game. But when juxtaposed with other RSPSes, there is an obvious difference, and we can attribute both benefits and detriments to our selection.

[Uim killerb]

if im begin totally honest, i didnt start doing videos becuase of a rank and neither do i continue to do it for that reason, the reason why i started was that i was acctaly about to quit. but makeing videos for me personally gives me a whole other way to enjoy pkhonor and get the nostalagi back that we all remember from when we first joined

i dont really like the idea of getting paid or reward for makeing content (dtick, money, items) i personally would much rather get "giveaways things" as compesation

and while i get what some say that it may not be the most fun to see videos of me doing clues and skilling with music playing in the back ground, but quite a few players asked me if i could do some kind of series were i acctally show the way i go about getting comp on a uim with all the small things that might not seem relavat at the time but will add up to something players can actally relate to.



and i get that the quality should be somewhat good. and im personally dont do that all the time or anything near that.
but for myself i do not have the time atm moment to put more hours into editing, while beging a apprentice chef

[Kalista]

I'm saying neither should get rewards. I can't name a single player who has come to or stayed on PKH because they saw a youtube video. The server doesn't need youtubers nor does it really benefit from them. The audience simply isn't there. The recognition in form of a rank and letting them post their content in a special discord channel is nice for them. Previewing content and what not would be nice too but I guess something like that is up to the supers to decide (and a bit useless since we have test server previews for most major content releases anyways).

I mean... Ain's videos did precisely that. I couldn't name them, but I know there were quite a few.

If I'm totally honest, if not for the blatant negligence that some people in power had towards Ain's contributions to the server (back when we were all kids and took that shit personally), I wouldn't have been arguing in favor of a Youtuber rank as much, if at all. Dude racked up atleast half a million views on PkHonor videos alone (you can actually count, I got bored after 400k but there were still a lot of PkHonor videos to tally) and sometimes got as many messages from new players as mods did.

The current rank, in my view, is a compromise of what I once believed it should've been and nothing at all.

The idea that staff members or ranks don't deserve rewards is a hard stance of the following idealism: staff members and ranked individuals should not seek rewards from their ranks, they should be motivated by passion or their ideals/personalities. Often we are jaded by years of experience in seeing people fail to meet this ideal, and we just assume that because there exists a reward, people will seek it out rather than commit to the true purpose of the job. So it's natural to bifurcate into one stance or the other.

However, rewarding their efforts (which are legitimately efforts a lot of the time, it can feel like a job) is not inherently bad. Staff members should/did get a boost in ::skilling, and also should be allowed to get a gift on Christmas (which I believe they often do). I don't think Youtubers, who have brought people to the game (I don't know if that still happens, but it certainly did and served as a strong motivator for the rank in the first place), should be exempt from in game rewards either. The problem is, I can agree that the influence of individual YouTubers seems lower than the past, and many of the popular RSPS Youtubers are exactly what we DON'T want in an ideal Youtuber - they seek out the servers that reward them over ones that wouldn't, like PkHonor.

Don't get me wrong - it's still fantastic that we do what we do. I don't want this to seem like the YT rank is inadequate - the idealism is removed from the reality of the situation and there is a ton of value in simply being recognized for great work on this game. But when juxtaposed with other RSPSes, there is an obvious difference, and we can attribute both benefits and detriments to our selection.

Yes, exactly. I also had ain in mind while arguing in favor for this. There were SO many people who played the game/kept playing the game just because of his videos. When he quit, and came back years later, I was motivated to also come back and give pkhonor another try. When he was banned and started trying other servers, tons of his viewers were directed to those servers. It would be almost zero cost to incentivize youtube videos, so I see no reason why it shouldn't happen.