PkHonor

So, I have been discussing clue scroll caskets lately- and I am starting to feel like they are actually hurting the game.
I am solely refering to the fact that they're tradeable, instead of untradeable.

So, hear me out-

Back in the day the best drop you could get from PvM would be the unique items dropped by that monster: Bandos equipment from Graardor, Armadyl pieces from Kree'arra, etc.
However, clue scrolls have changed this. Now, the best thing you can hope for is a clue scroll, which - when obtaining an Elite - is sold for a safe 1.5b - 2b.
Compared to the other drops from the monsters, this is a huge amount of value for a non-unique drop. Especially when dropped by monsters in a whole different tier.

I understand that this is nice if you have a 100b+ bank and its merely adding to the total.
But when looking at newer players, who might've just gotten an Elite from Barrows: they simply skipped through the game.
They now have 1.5b - 2b, which really gives them a flying start. They don't really have to go to Godwars, cause well, they just obtained themselves bandos equipment anyways, so there isn't really a point.
That drop, from a monster that isn't supposed to blatently drop items worth 2b, just took away from a lot of potential gameplay.

I'm not saying that we should remove the caskets. But I'm petitioning to make them untradeable. This would stop players from just selling them for hard cash, and open them instead!
Try their luck, and they might get 800m+ nonetheless. But it has a surprise factor to it. It is way more exciting than A) either selling it for 2b or B) open 250 caskets for a magic stone.

In my mind clue scrolls should be something fun to complete, and where you are happy with the rewards. Instead of just seeing it as a coin drop with ~6 steps.

So I'm actually just trying to get your opinion: what does the community think about this?
I'm not making this a yes-or-no thing. I simply want the opinion
Oh, and try to relate to a new player. Looking at content from a new-player perspective is something we, myself included, haven't done in a while.

I don't know if it's really skipping through the game, it's just an alternative route to getting there. I'm not aware of the numbers on this, but I would hope that getting an elite at barrows is less likely than at bandos, but I could be wrong.

As a new player, godwars is not that easy to solo. The minions hit pretty hard and you would be lucky to get double digit kills in mid tier gear in a trip. I'd wager that barrows, regardless of elites, is probably better gp per hour than godwars are a newer player. Having elites there is just an added bonus.

As for making elites tradeable, is it too far gone at this point? I know some merchers who have a lot of elites and master clues saved up that they bought rather than earned. Just my rambling two cents.

I think that this would be an interesting option to explore - especially if we were to get all the items that OSRS has in terms of cosmetic and ETC.

I don't have a strong preference either way, but I do agree that players shouldn't be specifically trying to get elites for best gp/hr through wildy bosses (elites outside of wild are ass). Although, that is how a lot of new players make money because how many people are actively buying bandos/arma/etc? I'm not sure on the numbers but there is almost always offers in for elites and that could be alluring for newer players to chase elites rather than other harder to sell drops.

But like Troll n Roll said, it might be too far gone to really make a hard decision like this to switch it to untradeable.

Do not make clue caskets untradeable please. There is a HUGE in fact one of the biggest markets is clue caskets...

So... to help with the decline of new players coming in to the game you want to nerf a really good moneymaker for new players?

Ensignor wrote:So... to help with the decline of new players coming in to the game you want to nerf a really good moneymaker for new players?

Say it louder for the people in the back

Kenneth wrote:

Guess they never miss, huh?

Elites are the greatest money sink and incentivize players to step into the Wilderness to make some cash with the risk of getting PKed, which the general drop tables of wildy NPCs don't do.

Magic Stone is on average 1T if you buy Elite or Master caskets, most rewards are cosmetics and have no further use, this way the richest amongst us waste their GPs on nothing while the newer players obtain some cash to start with. It's fine as is.

Additionally, elite casket has a 1 in 500 chance at getting the m stone, I've been killing Frost dragons in Wilderness for a while on my Ironman and I've gotten 210 kills an hour on average in near BiS gear:



Assuming players don't bring near BiS gear in Wildy, I take an average of 150 kills an hour (that might even be high), I've averaged 1 Elite casket every 170 Frost Dragons so that'd be 68 minutes per elite for other players, not taking into account that someone might get PKed 20 times during the grind, but on average that would take around 566 hours to finally obtain the Magic stone.. I don't know the conversion of Wildy clue rates of Ironmen vs Regular players but it might even be worse than this..

If people really want to grind General Graardor for a Bandos set, they will, or they will make an ironman on which they do this. If they don't want to do that and make a quick cash then Frost dragons in Wilderness is the way to go and I don't think that needs to be changed.

Ensignor wrote:So... to help with the decline of new players coming in to the game you want to nerf a really good moneymaker for new players?

That is correct. Easily getting loads of cash ≠ enjoying a game. It completely devalues the progress-curve, something PkHonor drives on.
Its the same as getting a load of cash from a friend when you just started. You won't have to grind barrows, you won't have to try to earn some cash from skilling, etc.
At the end of the day you don't find any motivation to enjoy the things that earn you a lower amount of cash, cause well- why would you?

Troll n roll wrote:As a new player, godwars is not that easy to solo. The minions hit pretty hard and you would be lucky to get double digit kills in mid tier gear in a trip. I'd wager that barrows, regardless of elites, is probably better gp per hour than godwars are a newer player. Having elites there is just an added bonus.

I agree with that completely. Godwars is hard, until you get some better barrows gear, maybe a rapier and are able to venture into the godwars dungeon (alone or with a friend).
But finding out that, "Hey, Bandos is about 400m an hour but I might as well just do Frost dragons for 1.5b an hour- because it has low requirements and earns me way much more cash".
It's an underwelming feeling, and a reason to completely put content aside. Not to mention it saturates the game as a whole.

Troll n roll wrote:As for making elites tradeable, is it too far gone at this point? I know some merchers who have a lot of elites and master clues saved up that they bought rather than earned. Just my rambling two cents.

It's not about the caskets in the game, those can simply be opened without any problems.
It's about new caskets coming into the game. Players always get told to sell the caskets, but why not change that and make it so they don't feel like they wasted their money when opening one.

Nazuths wrote:Elites are the greatest money sink ...

I personally don't agree that Elites are a money sink. No money is going out of the game. They're a money divide, something completely different- and something that isn't per definition healthy for the game:
For example, If we have two players, player X and Y.
Player X has to play through the game without any support, and earns his way up to full torva and a custom whip, by grinding the game and bossing.
Player Y has a friend with a 1T bank, who gives him some starting out cash so he can buy himself a custom whip and grind towards Torva.
Which of these players will enjoy their time more? Might be an exaggerated example, but hopefully you get my point.

Nazuths wrote:... and incentivize players to step into the Wilderness to make some cash with the risk of getting PKed, which the general drop tables of wildy NPCs don't do.

This is probably best arguments against making them untradeable. But players will still be able to hunt clue scrolls in the wilderness: their droprate won't be changed at all.
Players will still need them for achievements, selling their rewards, etc. I am, however, a fan of spicing up the wilderness npcs a bit to compensate for lost incentivize.

Nazuths wrote:Assuming players don't bring near BiS gear in Wildy, I take an average of 150 kills an hour (that might even be high), I've averaged 1 Elite casket every 170 Frost Dragons so that'd be 68 minutes per elite for other players, not taking into account that someone might get PKed 20 times during the grind, but on average that would take around 566 hours to finally obtain the Magic stone.. I don't know the conversion of Wildy clue rates of Ironmen vs Regular players but it might even be worse than this..

If people really want to grind General Graardor for a Bandos set, they will, or they will make an ironman on which they do this. If they don't want to do that and make a quick cash then Frost dragons in Wilderness is the way to go and I don't think that needs to be changed.

The magic stones will still be coming into the game at the same rate. Players will still get clue scrolls, solve them, and open the caskets for rewards. The amount of clue caskets opened will remain the same.

But the idea of earning roughly ~1.5b an hour, for a new player that started an hour ago, is insane.
Why would anyone even bother to ever look at any other potentional pieces of content when they could just earn that kind of solid cash from an npc that has minimal risk associated?
If the clue scrolls would be untradeable, receiving one every hour would still be extremely nice (and an incentive to ironman players). You can solve them, open it and you might still get a good reward.


From my own perspective, as an older player, I love to be able to sell my elites. Simply cause I know I will regret it if I don't.
But I've grown quite skeptical of their contribution to the health of the game.